Lmm VS lml - Chevy and GMC Duramax Diesel Forum
07.5-10 LMM Duramax Powertrain Discussion of components that are directly involved in the power production and all that is needed to get and keep the truck moving . Engine , Transmission, Etc.

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post #1 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 08:02 PM Thread Starter
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Lmm VS lml

Ok so to start not sure if this is the right spot if not I can move it.

So I have an appointment to see a 2012 gmc Denali duramax tomorrow with 80000 kms on the clock. Told salesmen I didn't want to deal with DEF anymore as I want a more simple'ish truck. He said well if we can get you the delete and tuner and work it in the price would you consider it. So the obvious answer is yes. Originally I told him anything from 06-10 but being a salesmen he pushed to a 12. As of right now I'm in a position where I'm not desperate at all so if it's not in the cards I'll walk in a heartbeat.

Back to the question lol is the lml any better or worse in terms of general reliability? Heard some stories of the cp4 being somewhat unpredictable. Basically truck is gonna be a daily driver with a distant future of towing so the updated frame and suspension isn't a deal breaker or maker. Modest mods like updated fuel delivery and emissions deletes. Basically a stock truck but mods to improve reliability.
Just general questions any info would be appreciated thanks guys

Tyler
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post #2 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 08:39 PM
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I really love my LML. I heard the CP4 issue was remedied and there's a poll on here that would seem to agree

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post #3 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 10:29 PM
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I would say its a toss up. The LML is going to have more power (stock) 397/765 vs 365/660. Since you are going to delete either way the power difference is pretty negligible since EFI Live can make the difference.

-Reliability of the CP4 would scare me...

-LML has a newer chassis and updated suspension, not sure how much better they ride or if that is a selling point for you. They are also going to have a higher GVWR...

-LMM has the same pistons as the LBZ, which some say or the weak link in the motor, should be an issue unless your pushing over 600hp though...

So kinda boils down to wanting to deal with the CP4 in exchange for a beefier frame and different suspension. Or stay with the proven CP3 and have older frame/suspension....

-Jimmy
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post #4 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-03-2017, 11:36 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by novaman64 View Post
I would say its a toss up. The LML is going to have more power (stock) 397/765 vs 365/660. Since you are going to delete either way the power difference is pretty negligible since EFI Live can make the difference.

-Reliability of the CP4 would scare me...

-LML has a newer chassis and updated suspension, not sure how much better they ride or if that is a selling point for you. They are also going to have a higher GVWR...

-LMM has the same pistons as the LBZ, which some say or the weak link in the motor, should be an issue unless your pushing over 600hp though...

So kinda boils down to wanting to deal with the CP4 in exchange for a beefier frame and different suspension. Or stay with the proven CP3 and have older frame/suspension....
Thanks for the reply.
How's your lmm treating you? I checked out your build thread looks pretty good. Ride isn't that important. I had a 2014 Dodge one ton single wheel cummins. Wasn't a bad ride but you could tell it was set up for towing not cruising lol I think I'll just see how this '12 is and what they decide to give me on numbers. Not overly sold on the LML completely. I feel like it has its benefits for sure but the known issues with the cp4 are making my gut tell me no.

I did read that cp4 poll thread and from what I read it wasn't as crazy of an issue as I thought but the fact that it's somewhat random and seems to happen more than necessary. Salesman seems desperate enough may get to talk him into updating the cp4 haha a guy can dream.
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post #5 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-04-2017, 03:22 PM
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Dont forget tuning on the LML is expensive!

Good luck, let us know how the LML is when you check it out.

-Jimmy
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post #6 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-04-2017, 03:44 PM
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I did not go to newer than a LMM is due to two things: First: I like to do my own tuning and efi live did not support reading and some other functionality for an LML. Second: Had two buddies upgrade to LML and both needed head gaskets prior to 50k. Since then both have been fine, but I still would not buy one unless it was 10k below book, cherry and deleted since new.

Trans is marginally heavier built in a LML vs prior.
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post #7 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-04-2017, 05:22 PM Thread Starter
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Dont forget tuning on the LML is expensive!

Good luck, let us know how the LML is when you check it out.
Well i checked out 3 trucks. 2 2012's and one 2015.

First 12 was a Denali 2500 with 80,000 kms. Very nice truck I had the best feeling when driving it. Once I figured out the history I passed. Oilfield truck, long service intervals. 30,000 before first service not sure if he did 3 oil changes himself or what but it was enough to raise flags. Salesman and manager also lied to us saying never left the city and driven by an older fellow. BS we figured it out and he eventually admitted it was an oilfield truck. PASS

15 slt was ok. One thing I liked was the levelling kit but they had 265 tires on which looked really dumb. Interior wasn't detailed with stains all over the dash and obviously a smoker owned it before. Was not happy while sitting in it until I put the peddle down. Wow that truck hauled a$$. Really liked the power but overall didn't like it at all. Previous history had 2 accidents and the fuel filter said 1%. Coulda been an electrical error dunno but the fuel filter wasn't replaced when it came in from trade and has been on the lot since november so no excuse for that or the interior. Salesman apparently talked to a tech and the tech said i shouldn't run from the truck regardless of the 1%. Apparently having a filter at 1% is ok according to them. I haven't heard such retardation in my life. PASS

The other 2012 was a complete waste of time. Different dealer than the previous 2 but wow. It was a trade in that they hadn't decided whether to fix it or auction off. $6000 in repairs needing done. Steering box and other components need replacing, tires, tanny seal and transfer case seal etc. Was told if they fixed it for me they could only drop the price $1000, BS. Slimy salesman and manager. Salesman took the trade in but told us he didn't and denied where it came from. Wasn't told about any of these issues prior to the test drive and i went on the highway while doing 130 kph. Very angry after i found out the truck wasn't really fit to drive also numerous electrical problems. Oh and the engine was replaced by GM wasn't told about that till later to. Obvious PASS

Sorry for the rant just figured I'd share my experiences thus far. So far not so good but I'm not in a rush. Not gonna buy a truck until I find the perfect one so if it takes a year that's fine with me.

Tyler
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post #8 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-04-2017, 05:25 PM
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Sounds like the first dealer is super shady. Wouldnt go back there, hate when they try and cover stuff up...
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post #9 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-04-2017, 05:29 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Shanta View Post
I did not go to newer than a LMM is due to two things: First: I like to do my own tuning and efi live did not support reading and some other functionality for an LML. Second: Had two buddies upgrade to LML and both needed head gaskets prior to 50k. Since then both have been fine, but I still would not buy one unless it was 10k below book, cherry and deleted since new.

Trans is marginally heavier built in a LML vs prior.
Makes sense. I wouldn't buy a truck unless they worked with the price. I think i want a LMM more so than the lml. '15s are really nice but ya just didn't get a solid vibe from the 3 i tried so far. Haven't driven a lmm yet as there aren't any on the lots near by but i'm sure that one salesman I dealt with first will be searching pretty hard lol he was desperate and ok to deal with.

Tyler
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post #10 of 70 (permalink) Old 02-04-2017, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by novaman64 View Post
Sounds like the first dealer is super shady. Wouldnt go back there, hate when they try and cover stuff up...

They weren't brutally honest with me but i'd go in again if they found the perfect truck but ya i hear ya. They aren't my first choice tho for sure so i'm gonna inquire else where first. There are so many dealerships in my city and Alberta is truck country so my choices are endless for dealers AKA stealerships lol. Second one was horrible. I have never been around that greasy of salesmen ever. Heard many stories but never dealt with it first hand. Just horrible basically the definition of slimy. That dealer is crossed off.

Not a good start but like i said i have many options and not giving up on getting a duramax.

Tyler
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