[Bsimster]

Bought one at Walmart, it was $13, Napa $8, Menards $11, Cenex $18. It seems to be all over the place.

Whatever it costs - just dont ever buy / use the "Platinum" no bueno for GM sensors

OP - sucks but at least it was an "easy" fix, all things considered. Lesson learned for sure

 

[Caper11]

I’m glad it worked out.
I thought the DEF filler nozzle was smaller in diameter than a gas nozzle???? I’ve never filled up at a def pump tho.


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[FLWhaler]

Keep in mind usually DEF pumps have a flap over the handle. I know that’s the case at Bucees

 

[dbaswell]

I paid 22 in NM this past week. Ridiculous.


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What DEF and where did you get it? I just bought Blue DEF a week or so ago in Ruidoso for under $13. Walmart there is showing it for the same price right now and their brand for $7.88.

 

[TCDiesel]

Hmmmm Obviously You owners have the fear DEF god in every Keystroke, I been running 2.5 Gallons Distilled water to 1 Gallon DEF in My 2015 LML since New, Not a single issue, My 2013 Ram been on Distilled water (100%) during the summer months and 2.5 Gallons DEF to 1 Gallon Distilled Water Same for the D-max in winter. New Trucks (2018+) have quality Sensor that triggers Codes at 22% so its a diet of 2.5 Gallons DEF to 1 Gallon Distilled water, the 67/33% is just not necessary and that ratio hard on the DEF pump and has crystallized many DEF Injectors leaving the truck in de-rated power or worst. Here's a video on My 2013 Ram, I should do one for the D-max. Maybe next year...... Yes I'm Todd From TC Diesel, in addition to My automotive and DSL companies I own and operate additional Businesses one just happens to be exterior remodeling.

Distilled water - YouTube

 

[Caper11]

The Ram is a more robust emissions system, and a more efficient engine.

I would like to hear your results with the Dmax.

 

[TCDiesel]

Its the Same Caper11, I have one Owner/Customer at over 500K+ miles on his LML (2013), He's commercial transporter on 2nd set of Injectors and 3rd CP4 Pump, He just replace the CP4 at 510K. OEM pump at 256K miles . Same DEF/DPF systems Factory. He Does have Auxiliary filtration on OEM Tank and one 50 Gallon Transfer Tank Filtration. I Have tore down both of his CP4s, they were tired but likely could have made 300K miles. My guess he's nearing 600K+ miles. He wants to make 750K miles and replace engine and takes some time off.

 

[66436]

IMO it doesn’t matter the colour, it should not be a identifier of the product. The actual label is the proper identifier.

Yes you are going to get a code or warning about the DEF. It may not happen right away but it will eventually when the dosing rate goes to max. It being gas, I would be concerned.


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Here is a very simple case where the DOT should get involved and make a national standard for color coding. I had seen this numerous times regarding fueling of aircraft! Smaller airports that pump jet fuel will have an extra tank with a product called PRIST. It keeps any suspended water in fuel from turning into ice and blocking fuel filters in jet engines and on these fuel trucks is injected into the fuel as it is pumped into the aircraft. Bigger airports use trucks that have the PRIST premixed so it is not a problem there, only at smaller airports that can't afford to have both kinds of trucks. Where the problem comes in is newer fuel truck run on diesel that uses DEF. There is no color coding or standards for this and the DEF tank is right next to the PRIST tank. There have been cases were line personnel, not knowing the difference have put DEF in the PRIST tank and being DEF is mostly water you can imagine what that does to aircraft!

There should be a national standard for this. There are too many different products out there that can be mistaken for other products and cause damage to our vehicles! Dean

 

[TCDiesel]

I agree Dean E, Thier should be a label on top of the Nozzle so when you stick it into the Neck/Tank you will see DEF.

 

[Bsimster]

Im on board with it. They go to lengths to establish different colored caps and fuel jugs - but dont have a standard for what dispenses in to those said containers. Ive personally fallen victim to the BP green being gas instead of fuel - thankfully i clicked the Diesel button so the gas handle just beeped and didnt flow.

Or notch the nozzle a certain way to limit what it fits in. Even though different sizes, still can fit a smaller nozzle in to a larger filler neck. The notch can limit what actually fits where

 

[Caper11]

Its the Same Caper11, I have one Owner/Customer at over 500K+ miles on his LML (2013), He's commercial transporter on 2nd set of Injectors and 3rd CP4 Pump, He just replace the CP4 at 510K. OEM pump at 256K miles . Same DEF/DPF systems Factory. He Does have Auxiliary filtration on OEM Tank and one 50 Gallon Transfer Tank Filtration. I Have tore down both of his CP4s, they were tired but likely could have made 300K miles. My guess he's nearing 600K+ miles. He wants to make 750K miles and replace engine and takes some time off.

Interesting, Are you operating in warm climates??? Adding water will increase the freezing point.
Unfortunately these are older trucks and I was wondering about the L5P.


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[Caper11]

I didn’t think a fuel nozzle would fit in the DEF neck properly anyway.
Manufacturers are to blame, IMO gas GM trucks have a yellow cap, majority of the industry identifies diesel, as yellow, even diesel jugs. Color is unreliable method of identification, all black would be better.


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[TCDiesel]

Did you use TQ or Stretch Method? Did you measure the length and keep a log on each bolt? If you use TQ Method just set TQ wrench to -5LBS if they move your the bolt should be replaced and measured and log correctly.

Interesting, Are you operating in warm climates??? Adding water will increase the freezing point.
Unfortunately these are older trucks and I was wondering about the L5P.


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DEF 67/33% freezes at about 12F , So yes I do Raise the level of Urea During winter Months 70/30% - 80/20% , it still freezes Last winter all My trucks (DSL) sat outside during the Feb 20 / -25-30F for close to two weeks error free, That level of Urea is API/EPA Bull, when I had the fuel analyzer on My 2015 Eco DSL, I was testing the levels because that engine behave odd, I broke the scandal 2 Years before the EPA sued FIAT, Its well document on some sites, the 3.0VM is a dirty filthy motor. Even at 90/10% DEF the NOx meter rarely peg over 5 PPM. I did the math the best I could estimate, I would have to drive the Engine at WOT for 700K Miles just to produce a FEW OZ of NOx.

Back last FEB in Bozeman MT I was pouring 2.5 Gallons of Distilled water in My DEF Tank at Smiths Grocery Parking lot and this Guy pull up to Me an ask What I was doing pouring water in My Gas/Fuel Tank, He drove of PO when I told him it runs on Water like in Back to the future.

You can by Refractometer to check the level.

 

[TCDiesel]

I condemn API/EPA for handling the DEF % and all the BS Regulation EPA / API mandates on DEF, Thier hands are dripping of Green.

You can make your own DEF the DS (Distilled water is available everywhere) You just need a Source for the Urea, Some have claimed to used Stabilized Nitrogen in place of Urea error free.

 

[redwngr]

Urea/water ratio in def was picked so that stays in solution thru the freeze/thaw cycle.

As long as the truck can increase the fluid dose enough to compensate for the water and still reduce the NOx enough to satisfy the NOx sensors life should be good.

Nationally, US pricing for bulk def is less than the price for diesel.

 

[TCDiesel]

They just guessed. I have kept good track of the consumption over the years, You could overlay the charts.

Red, the Ratio is what causes most of the DEF system Problems. API certification cost about $7/10K yearly blood money, API also gets a royalty fee $0.001 that equals $1.00 for every 1000 gallons
sold. The USA spent 23+$ Billion on DEF 2020 that's 7.5 Billon Gallons that's what another $750,000.00 Someone do the math and correct Me please.

 

[redwngr]

EPA doesn't mandate DEF.
EPA mandates the NOx level.

Method of achieving the NOx level is up to manufacturer.

 

[durabroke]

So, my first diesel, and this is all new to me.

I filled up at a Buc-ee's a few months ago and noticed that DEF was available to pump just like fuel. Blue pump handle, very cool.

A few days ago the DIC instructed me to add DEF. So today I pulled into Buc-ee's and topped off the diesel, then I grabbed the blue handle to add DEF. It was a bit of a struggle to get the nozzle into the DEF hole (difficult, actually) and when I tried to squeeze the pump handle fluid shot out and made a bit of a mess.

Several moments of confusion later, I realized that I had been trying to pump Buc-ee's ethanol-free gasoline into my DEF tank.

So:

1: Why in the fudge would Buc-ee's use blue to color-code their ethanol-free gasoline and DEF? Why not pink, or something?

2: Maybe an ounce or less of gasoline went into the DEF tank. Should I be concerned?

Thanks, guys.

Dude...You have to read to drive one of these. They sell DEF inside Buc-ees

 

[Stbentoak]

I didn’t think a fuel nozzle would fit in the DEF neck properly anyway.
Manufacturers are to blame, IMO gas GM trucks have a yellow cap, majority of the industry identifies diesel, as yellow, even diesel jugs. Color is unreliable method of identification, all black would be better.


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A little off topic, but believe it or not, Jaguar/Land rover has a patented filler neck design that will only accept passenger diesel nozzles. Passenger diesel nozzles are not the same size as petrol nozzles…
Will not accept a RUL nozzle or a big diesel nozzle. Has saved many newbie’s….There isn’t any reason one couldn’t be designed for DEF the same way. 2.5’s could be designed with the same limiting dia spout as dispenser nozzle fillers.

 

[TCDiesel]

EPA doesn't mandate DEF.
EPA mandates the NOx level.

Method of achieving the NOx level is up to manufacturer.

I here Ya, Here's the standard, You can meet these standards in many engines/vehicles without the 33% Urea API set. Why do I know , because I was running 90/10% and hitting these levels in My 3.0VM and that engine is dirty, no where near as clean as D-Max / Ram Cummins 2013+ Intake/ exhaust / EGR / Combustion events, Etc. Some In head EGR systems are amazingly good at lowering NOx, yet we still have that AECD (EGR) bolted to most on road Vehicle Engines..

https://nepis.epa.gov/Exe/ZyPDF.cgi?Dockey=P100O9ZJ.pdf