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There have been some official and un official youtube videos on it now.
 

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I'm surprised they don't offer the L5P (vs the detuned L5D) as an option on these trucks. If I was a fleet manager I'd probably order L5Ds for longevity and reduced maintenance, but if it was for personal use I'd definitely want the higher HP/torque tune of the L5P. They could also offer re-tuning at dealerships if the truck's use profile is going to change. Seems like obvious "value added" at negligible manufacturer cost.
 

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I'm surprised they don't offer the L5P (vs the detuned L5D) as an option on these trucks. If I was a fleet manager I'd probably order L5Ds for longevity and reduced maintenance, but if it was for personal use I'd definitely want the higher HP/torque tune of the L5P. They could also offer re-tuning at dealerships if the truck's use profile is going to change. Seems like obvious "value added" at negligible manufacturer cost.
I won't say that I have read everything / watched every youtube video on this, but I have searched on what I can find.

It appears that the turbo on the L5D and some tuning are the largest differences - at least to me.

My perception is that the L5D setup is more focused on providing more torque "off the line" and at lower rpms vs. the L5P has more torque at higher rpms. It sort of makes sense - imagine a truck with these higher GVWRs (example a cement truck or heavy duty tow truck). They aren't going to go 90 mph up a hill, but definitely need as much torque as possible at a stop light.
 

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I signed up on the chevy web site for more information as it becomes available. (as a business)

I did receive one email basically asking how many my business needed ( under 50, something like 50 - 100, 100 - 500, etc)

I answered - "under 50".

It is pretty obvious from that question that they are going to first focus on the people that say "a bunch of them for large fleets", which makes perfect sense.

I guess it gives me a bit more time to save up.
 

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I won't say that I have read everything / watched every youtube video on this, but I have searched on what I can find.

It appears that the turbo on the L5D and some tuning are the largest differences - at least to me.

My perception is that the L5D setup is more focused on providing more torque "off the line" and at lower rpms vs. the L5P has more torque at higher rpms. It sort of makes sense - imagine a truck with these higher GVWRs (example a cement truck or heavy duty tow truck). They aren't going to go 90 mph up a hill, but definitely need as much torque as possible at a stop light.
That seems reasonable. And while it's possible to achieve whatever torque is desired via gear reduction, the engine is probably more thermodynamically efficient at lower RPMs, so a smaller/lighter turbo that makes the power curve steeper would be optimal (thermodynamically and, therefore, financially), even if the engine's maximum power is somewhat reduced. This has the additional benefit (to the fleet manager) of keeping the engine away from its maximum design power, thus increasing longevity.
 

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For me, GM not putting the DEF fill on the driverside of the truck I see this truck as a giant flop. Way worse location than on our trucks... at least with under the hood, the hose at the truck stop still reaches driving into the pump at an angle. Now on the passenger side fender wall, what do you do, drop the hood and stretch the hose over the motor?
 

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Keeps the likelihood of contamination lower?

Like the bobtail driver I had to rescue the other day, who mistakenly filled the DEF tank (next to the fuel tank) on the Freightliner with the BLUE nozzle 87 octane Ethanol free instead. 'dunno;

I've heard of similar stories where the DEF fill was inside the same fuel door as the Diesel. The DEF fill had a sleeve in it to keep a Diesel nozzle from fitting.....but not the smaller gasoline nozzles.
 

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On GM Vans and the Colorado and Canyon models the DEF Fill is next to the fuel fill on the driver side.

What Im saying is try pullling into a busy truck stop to refill DEF with a trailer and you have to either try to go the opposite way the line is to pull up to the pump, bring your on container to fill DEF, or pay over $5 a gallon more to buy their containers they sell inside.

Its just stupid that GM is still are not aware of, after 10 years of DEF, they do not know what side of the vehicle the Fueling stations put the DEF pump on.

What I think is even worse yet is International did not object to this placement. What would be funny is if on their brand badged models they put the fill on the driver side.

I still get stares when I drive at an angle into the pump with my 3500 2013s.
 

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Well, considering the DEF only needs to be filled every 5000 miles or so, and at 100 000 miles the warranty is up and I'd delete, then I'd only have to fill the thing 19 times. So honestly, I wouldn't care at all where they put it. No matter where it goes, somebody's going to be complaining.

From the perspective of a fleet manager (who's opinions matter way more than ours) they wouldn't want it where it's likely to get filled with diesel or gas. They have a lot of different drivers, and they know that they're going to get someone putting fuel into the DEF if it's anywhere near the fuel fill. And they'd rather just have their mechanics fill the DEF at each oil change.


But anyway, this is a sharp-looking truck. I'd love to have one as an RV hauler. Or a motorhome - hopefully the RV companies make Super C motorhomes out of them.
 

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I have to admit to being a bit disappointed in the cab of these new 4500 / 500 series.

It looks very small - similar to the size of the 2500 / 3500, in some ways even smaller since my main interest is in having a lot of height in the door opening, interior height, and a lot of room for people to be in the back seat.

I am starting to think that I will end up with one of the older kodiaks instead of a new 4500.

What a waste to make a truck like this, and then make the cab and front axle width so narrow.

Perhaps worse - they cannot figure out how to move away from a straight axle design? Army trucks with much higher weight ratings have 4x4 and independent suspensions.

Hopefully I am missing something but it seems like a bunch of body molding is going into making the cab short and narrow, and nearly 100 year old straight axle technology going into the suspension to save a few bucks.
 

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I have to admit to being a bit disappointed in the cab of these new 4500 / 500 series.

It looks very small - similar to the size of the 2500 / 3500, in some ways even smaller since my main interest is in having a lot of height in the door opening, interior height, and a lot of room for people to be in the back seat.

I am starting to think that I will end up with one of the older kodiaks instead of a new 4500.

What a waste to make a truck like this, and then make the cab and front axle width so narrow.

Perhaps worse - they cannot figure out how to move away from a straight axle design? Army trucks with much higher weight ratings have 4x4 and independent suspensions.

Hopefully I am missing something but it seems like a bunch of body molding is going into making the cab short and narrow, and nearly 100 year old straight axle technology going into the suspension to save a few bucks.
Are you thinking of the USMC 7-ton?

 

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Well, considering the DEF only needs to be filled every 5000 miles or so, and at 100 000 miles the warranty is up and I'd delete, then I'd only have to fill the thing 19 times. So honestly, I wouldn't care at all where they put it. No matter where it goes, somebody's going to be complaining.

From the perspective of a fleet manager (who's opinions matter way more than ours) they wouldn't want it where it's likely to get filled with diesel or gas. They have a lot of different drivers, and they know that they're going to get someone putting fuel into the DEF if it's anywhere near the fuel fill. And they'd rather just have their mechanics fill the DEF at each oil change.


But anyway, this is a sharp-looking truck. I'd love to have one as an RV hauler. Or a motorhome - hopefully the RV companies make Super C motorhomes out of them.
Regarding the bolded part of the quote, that's probably what you'd expect from an unloaded SRW truck (about 1,000 miles per gallon of DEF). I just finished a 9,200-mile road trip with my L5P at a GCW of just over 19,000 lbs, and my DEF consumption was approximately 500 miles per gallon. A 4500 or 5500 pulling a large toy hauler is going to have a GCW in the 25,000 to 30,000 lb range (and with more frontal area than my SRW truck pulling my travel trailer, thus poorer aerodynamics), and I'd expect such a vehicle to be getting more like 300-400 miles per gallon of DEF, as DEF consumption is directly proportional to fuel consumption.
 

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Are you thinking of the USMC 7-ton?
Honestly I have looked at so many trucks lately it is hard to keep them all straight.

The cab over version of the 4500 appears to be a re-labelled Isuzu import, which is sort of against my goal of trying to purchaser a domestic / North America built product.

As an example though, Navistar makes a number of products and platforms in their military group that could have been the basis for a product like this:

https://www.navistardefense.com/navistardefense/

I didn't try, but I doubt that Navistar defense would sell something to a normal citizen like me.
 

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Honestly I have looked at so many trucks lately it is hard to keep them all straight.

The cab over version of the 4500 appears to be a re-labelled Isuzu import, which is sort of against my goal of trying to purchaser a domestic / North America built product.

As an example though, Navistar makes a number of products and platforms in their military group that could have been the basis for a product like this:

https://www.navistardefense.com/navistardefense/

I didn't try, but I doubt that Navistar defense would sell something to a normal citizen like me.
Having operated a wide range of military vehicles over an even wider range of operating conditions, I say definitively that I would not want to own personally any vehicle whose design was the result of (or influenced by) the military/government procurement process. Even if I had any confidence in those vehicles, getting parts and service for them would be somewhere between difficult and impossible.

What is your specific application? My sense of things is that for tow rigs there's rarely a use in going beyond a 1-ton DRW, unless you're often dealing with trailers over 30k lbs, in which case it may be best to go all the way up to a class 8 rig. Most of the gooseneck trailers out there have their axles positioned such that even a very heavy load can be configured in order to keep a 1-ton DRW's rear axle weight within legal limits. From what I've seen, class 4-7 trucks are usually purchased for heavy work/dump/tank bodies, and not necessarily for handling heavy trailers.
 

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I am just under 6 ft tall with a lot of my height in my torso. Periodic back and neck issues mean that I need a vehicle that I can enter any door opening without having to bend and not hit my head. I am also just plain tired of hitting my head on things, so I figure that since I turn 60 soon, I should buy a vehicle that I really like vs something completely practical.

It needs to be a vehicle that can be routinely parked in my neighborhood, so something like a class 8 is too big. Class 6 is even a push but might be possible.

If it cannot do these basic tasks, then it is a no - go.

I have sons taller than I am, and grand children, so it has to hold at least 4, and ideally 6 people very comfortably plus related vacation gear.

It will be used for a variety of personal and quasi business tasks, some include carrying around 1 - 2 K lb systems, (ideally a couple of them) plus the normal build out related items.

It would be really nice to have 4 wd for trips to the mountains because this enables me to not have to deal with chain installation on the side of a road. It is something that I could give up but prefer to have.

I want to be able to drive 500 miles and not be worn out from the drive due to being beat up by the road, so a good suspension, ideally 4 wheel independent suspension, air ride would be nice.

A 3500 is probably sufficient tow and weight capacity wise, but none of the ones that I have looked at meet the "no go" criteria. That is why I was looking at these 4500s - hoping it would be a modern version of the kodiak.

I went to a chevy dealer and sat in a 1500 and 2500 - neither one met the initial conditions - the door opening is too short for me to get in without bending (substantially I might add)

I looked at sprinter / transit / promaster vans and they fail as well due to either basic weight capacity limitations or door openings that in theory are tall enough (based on the specs) but in fact have door closers with steel spikes right at my forehead level. (guess how I found this out)

Right now I am driving an old 2000 dodge minivan and it is not even close to meeting the goals, but it has enabled me to understand the real needs and limitations better.

I know that this is not the normal reasoning for selecting a vehicle, especially a vehicle like a truck.
 

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Well, hate to be the bearer of bad news, but most of the Class 6-7 cabs would give you an entry problem too. I'm not near your upper torso dilemma, but I've still bumped my head on an FL.

I guess something like this wouldn't please the neighbors much, eh?


Yes, the bowtie cabovers are Isuzu relabeled. You'll bump your head there too.
The Crew Cabs on the new Chev 4500s are not a reflection of the pre '08 Kodiak/Topkicks' roomy cabs of old. They're smaller, but more in line with what both Fjord and Ram have done, with pickup bodies on a MD truck.

At your age and the things your desire, you might be better off finding one of the older ones, tricked up with the Monroe aftermarkets' air ride rear, cab, and seats (fronts are still MD leaf springs).
It takes some searching time, but they're out there. Bought as a Toter, traveled some, put a few miles up, but sat in storage most of their life.



 

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Well, looks like I can post on this forum for the old 4500/5500 series trucks even though I own a 2019 4500HD crew cab 4X4. Dealer only got the one in and not sure if or when he will ever get another but as of now, I have the only 4500 CC 4X4 truck in several counties.

I will post a few things about the truck as from what I have read there is a lot of misconceptions.

It is made by GM and Navistar so you can believe the frame and axles are up to whatever you have in mind. Both of the axles are made by Dana-Spicer and my truck has the 4:30 rear which GM says is rated at 11K, but the GM build sheet says 19K, and spicer says 14K. Decoding the VIN shows the truck to be a Class 5 truck(5500) so not sure what it is. I think GM builds them as one truck then rates them for whatever they want.

The cab, engine,trans,all electronics are made by GM and yes, it is a Silverado cab complete. Everything on a 3500 will fit this truck. Navistar builds the one piece tilt hood.
It comes with 19.5 wheels and mine came with Alcoas on the steer and outside rears with the Duralast finish on them. My truck was also spec'd as a LT trim level. Only other option is WT. The LT will not have carpet though, only the rubber mat.

Trans is an Allison 1700RDS (Rugged Duty Service) 6 speed. There are several different series trans available.

The engine is a Duramax L5D with 350HP and 700 # torque. From what I have found out, the ecm has a detuned programming different from the 5P engine but there is some questions about the turbo. I have found references that it is the same turbo as the 5P which would make sense from a parts interchangeability for GM but it is not operated as robustly as it is in the 5P engine due to the programming. I really can't tell alot of difference between the two engines and I have alot of miles on the earlier series as well as the 5P. The 5D is not a slouch by any means and I get on average pulling the big trailer 9.5-10.2 MPG.I pull a 23K horse trailer all over Texas and Oklahoma and I actually feel better doing it with the 4500Hd than I did with the Pete I had. Definitely rides better!

Biggest complaint I have is the turning radius with the 4 WD. It takes quite a bit of real estate to do a 3 point turn. The front axle has HUGE ujoints at the spindles so the accounts for the battleship turning radius.It is rated at 7500 for all 4WD trucks. It also has manual locking hubs but an electronic transfer case. Has about a 6" driveshaft and everything has a grease zerk.

The truck has several different wheel bases available depending on what you want to install. It does not have a standard bed nor any option to order one. I equipped mine with an 11 ft. CM flatbed with a 30K GN hitch.

Dual batteries are installed in box below the drivers door and the INTACT block heater plug is mounted on the aft end of that box. There is a jumper post on the front end of the box for jump starts.

My wife and I have driven nothing but 3500 Chevys for years so the stiff and sometimes harsh ride doesn't bother us. If the truck is loaded it rides like a 3500 and I put 3-400 mile days on some of the horse show trips and at a young 65 still manage to crawl/fall out and walk upright.

If anyone has questions I will try to answer them.
 

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I have read the posts on this forum comparing the old 4500's to the new ones. Apples to oranges.

First, the old ones were based on a cab front from the van bodies and they are butt ugly as far as I am concerned-- no style and looks like it was built from GM leftover parts. But from conversations I've had with old style owners, they were plagued by a lot of rattles, rode rough, and had electrical problems etc. Air suspensions were only in the rear-- just like the new 4500's (not available on 4WD). You could order a new 2020 one in CC 2WD with rear air susp. and the 7000# front axle and it would turn a little tighter and ride a little better depending on what bed you installed. CM makes a very nice Western Hauler type for the truck.

Fit and finish is outstanding on the new trucks and they are quiet inside. The cab mounts are larger than the 2500/3500 and the hood is really heavy duty construction. It aligns well with the cowl with no shake and has an alignment guide on each side.

Just for info-- I am 6'3", weigh 240 and am 65 and I have no problem getting into or out of the truck even though it sits quite high due to the 4WD. It has the power drivers seat so that makes it easier. Both front seats are heated-- surprised me as I didn't know you could get heated cloth seats.

This isn't a truck that most people will want-- my wife and I do use ours just like we did the 3500's before it. It goes to the grocery store/movies/out to supper/bank runs but it also hauls horses/cattle/fence pipe/round hay bales etc.

Don't even look at one if you want a 2500 ride quality-- ain't gonna happen. This is and was built to be a WORK truck. It will pull anything you want to tie on to and get decent mileage if that is a concern.
 
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