I have Air Lift bags on my 2011 2500 LML. Before I had them, my 5er would really make her squat. Max PSI for the bags are 100psi. I have to run about 80psi to get the truck level with my RV hitched up. I'm wondering if I would benefit any from also installing some Hellwig or similar brand helper springs? I've been towing this way for years without a problem, truck rides well, but I thought it would be nice to give the truck some more help and maybe not need such a high PSI in my bags. Thoughts?
Air Bags AND Helper Springs?
eli_harper13
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I have Air Lift bags on my 2011 2500 LML. Before I had them, my 5er would really make her squat. Max PSI for the bags are 100psi. I have to run about 80psi to get the truck level with my RV hitched up. I'm wondering if I would benefit any from also installing some Hellwig or similar brand helper springs? I've been towing this way for years without a problem, truck rides well, but I thought it would be nice to give the truck some more help and maybe not need such a high PSI in my bags. Thoughts?
What's the loaded total weight (and pin weight) of your 5W? Second question being your payload of your truck, which eventually leads to whether the truck is actally rated to handle the load. If you don't know, I'd recommend hooking up your rig and running it through CAT scales at your nearest truck stop. I think it costs $12 or so and will give you all the numbers you need. Or, if there is a free public access scale in your area (gravel yard, grain elevator, etc.) you can calculate all the numbers. Here is a guide with instructions.
On a 2011 your truck's actual weight (when it left the factory) should be printed on a yellow DOT sticker in the driver's doorjamb. Subtract that number from the trucks GVWR and that's your available payload. Keep in mind that all cargo weight in the truck (including people beyond the driver) will subtract from the payload number. As you mentioned, it's not that you can't physically pull the load as you've been doing it... but if the truck is overloaded based on how it was factory-designed, that would at least explain the squat.
On a 2011 your truck's actual weight (when it left the factory) should be printed on a yellow DOT sticker in the driver's doorjamb. Subtract that number from the trucks GVWR and that's your available payload. Keep in mind that all cargo weight in the truck (including people beyond the driver) will subtract from the payload number. As you mentioned, it's not that you can't physically pull the load as you've been doing it... but if the truck is overloaded based on how it was factory-designed, that would at least explain the squat.
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Well the dealer I bought from says I’m not over loaded, but I wouldn’t be surprised if I am. GVWR of the RV is 16,000lbs with a hitch weight of 2600lbs. Not sure on my truck as I am out of town so can’t look at the sticker. I know the GVWR of it is 10,000lbs but that’s all I remember.
I’m mostly just curious if anyone has experience on having both air bags and helper leaf springs? If it was worth it, if it improves handling and ride while towing? Or if I’m just over thinking it and my bags are doing their job as long as the psi is under the 100psi?
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Oh I should probably also add that my truck is levelled. So I am sure it’s “appears” to squat much more than it would if the front sat factory height. When I level it out with my bags for towing, I an having to raise the back to “unloaded level” not “level with the factory front.” If that makes sense.
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That’s what I’ve thought too. Truck has always squatted bad though, so I don’t think it’s from my springs being worn out.
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2600 Lbs is the Pin for an empty trailer. With a 16K gross your loaded pin is more likely between 3000 to 3500 Lbs. So you are probably in the area of 1000 to 1500 Lbs over weight and probably exceeding your tire capacity also.
Your choice but not a good place to be in the event of an accident.
Your choice but not a good place to be in the event of an accident.
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It’s possible. I do run the highest rated tires I can. Nitto Terra G2 295/70r18, rated for 4080lbs.
Adding helper springs or air bags wont increase the total load your truck can carry. Just need to be careful about where this load is applied to the frame.
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I know
Are your OE rear axle leaf spring packs in good shape? The OE spring packs In my LBZ are getting tired. Before airbags with the truck completely empty the primary spring pack is sitting on the overloads. I added airlift bags and keep them at 5 psi unloaded and that got me off the overloads. However, when I tow the ride is pretty “bouncy”. I run 35 psi unloaded then add the hitch weight.
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I think they are, my bags have been installed for a few years now. But the truck would squat a lot even when it was 2 years old (right after I purchased it used). It’s definitely not bouncy when I tow, feels just fine. And like I said earlier, I don’t think it squats as much as I thought because I forgot that with the truck being levelled, it’s going to appear to squat a lot more, vs a stock truck that sits a couple inches lower in the front.
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I would unlevel the front of the truck 1st. The trucks come with a factory rake so when you are hauling the truck is slightly raked or level. With the truck level or slightly raked front down it helps to keep a negative air pressure under the truck in the area of the radiator and front of the motor. This helps to pull air through the cooling stack. Once the front is higher than the rear the area under the front of the truck becomes an air grab and builds pressure instead of a vac on the stack. Trying to maintain the negative area just behind the radiator is the reason for the extra air dam below the front bumper on many trucks.
What weight rating air bags do you have? 80 psi gives different amount of of load lift depending on bag rated capacity.
What weight rating air bags do you have? 80 psi gives different amount of of load lift depending on bag rated capacity.
I have Air Lift bags and yesterday I had to pump them up to 75psi to get much action out of them with a 40ft XLR Boost triple axle toy hauler. I have no idea on the pin weight but being an empty toy hauler, it was substantial.
I think our springs are softer than most. Mine is a 2012 dually so it probably has one leaf more than your 2011 2500. I've already replaced the driver's side stack due to sagging. I think they're so long that they don't hold up much weight very well. This is undoubtedly for ride quality which is probably better than the competition. But it seems like the other guys can hold weight up better without sagging as much.
I think our springs are softer than most. Mine is a 2012 dually so it probably has one leaf more than your 2011 2500. I've already replaced the driver's side stack due to sagging. I think they're so long that they don't hold up much weight very well. This is undoubtedly for ride quality which is probably better than the competition. But it seems like the other guys can hold weight up better without sagging as much.
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I had Hellwig helper springs on my previous truck and now have air bags on my current truck. Not a fan of the helper springs because they stiffen the ride when unloaded. Air bags are the best option for both worlds, low pressure when not towing and adjustable higher pressure when towing. The 80 psi is not a big deal, I have used this pressure many times when hauling heavy equipment. If you are worried about this, they do offer a heavy duty 7,500 lb. air bag option (click on LoadLifter 7500 XL web link below).
LoadLifter 7500 XL
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My 5er is 39ft, only dual axle. Yeah, I believe it’s only one less spring. Maybe so, cause my truck has squatted even before it was old enough for them to be worn out.
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Thank you! I was hoping to hear from someone that has had the helper springs and could tell me what they are like. I definitely don’t want a harsher ride. I will stick to just my air bags then. If I were to add anything else, it might would be the extra over load spring that comes on the 3500.
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Wanted to mention one thing on the Hellwig springs. They claim adjustability, which is simply adjusting the preload on the mounting hardware where the two ends of the helper spring attach to the main leaf spring pack. So you have to get under the truck with a wrench and socket (or air wrench) and adjust the preload to level the rear of the truck with the trailer on. Then after towing you would have to once again get under the truck and release the preload to get your factory ride back. I would much rather push a button from the comfort of my drivers seat to increase or decrease the pressure in my air bags.
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